Обсуждение: Re: [GENERAL] A bit confused about Postgres Plus
Thomas Kellerer wrote:
> as the Enterprise DB distribution ("One Click Installer") seems to be
> the recommendation from the Postgres team for a binary download, I
> wonder what the exact difference between Postgres and Postgres Plus
> is.
"Recommendation"? I find this a worrying statement, and hereby request
that the one-click installer is moved after the community supported
packages where we have them (Windows and Linux), and that the source
code link is moved upper in the main downloads page.
--
Alvaro Herrera http://www.CommandPrompt.com/
The PostgreSQL Company - Command Prompt, Inc.
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 12:28 PM, Alvaro Herrera
<alvherre@commandprompt.com> wrote:
> Thomas Kellerer wrote:
>
>> as the Enterprise DB distribution ("One Click Installer") seems to be
>> the recommendation from the Postgres team for a binary download, I
>> wonder what the exact difference between Postgres and Postgres Plus
>> is.
>
> "Recommendation"? I find this a worrying statement, and hereby request
> that the one-click installer is moved after the community supported
> packages where we have them (Windows and Linux), and that the source
> code link is moved upper in the main downloads page.
There are no community binaries on the Linux page - everything comes
from a third party website, and all packages are maintained by people
active in the community. Regarding support, the community itself has
always been distribution-agnostic as long as the build is unmodified
from standard.
Besides, it's pretty darn clear (in bold text in fact) from the
download page that you are recommended to use the distro-specific
packages where possible - the installers act as a catch-all for those
users that aren't sure what they want, which has been proven time and
time again to cause confusion, and often to make them go look at the
competition instead.
--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
On Wed, 2008-12-17 at 12:48 +0000, Dave Page wrote: > On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 12:28 PM, Alvaro Herrera > <alvherre@commandprompt.com> wrote: > > Thomas Kellerer wrote: > > > There are no community binaries on the Linux page - everything comes > from a third party website, and all packages are maintained by people > active in the community. Regarding support, the community itself has > always been distribution-agnostic as long as the build is unmodified > from standard. Well that depends on the definition of community doesn't it? ;) > > Besides, it's pretty darn clear (in bold text in fact) from the > download page that you are recommended to use the distro-specific > packages where possible - the installers act as a catch-all for those > users that aren't sure what they want, which has been proven time and > time again to cause confusion, and often to make them go look at the > competition instead. Perception is reality, not the words on the page. If Postgres Plus is what is listed first, .Org is saying use Postgres Plus. It is what it is. People don't want to read they want to click. No offense to Thomas... Its just the human condition, I do the same thing with sites I am not familiar with. Sincerely, Joshua D. Drake -- PostgreSQL Consulting, Development, Support, Training 503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/ The PostgreSQL Company,serving since 1997
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 5:36 PM, Joshua D. Drake <jd@commandprompt.com> wrote: > Perception is reality, not the words on the page. If Postgres Plus is > what is listed first, .Org is saying use Postgres Plus. Postgres Plus isn't even on that page. -- Dave Page EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
Without getting into the debate about which distributions should or shouldn't be on the download page, I was surprised recently to encounter difficulty finding the source code. I seem to remember that there used to be a direct link to it from the handy "Latest releases" box at the top right of the site's front page. You now have to go to the download page, then hunt some way down the page before locating it (below development snapshots and 3rd-party distributions, which seems a little odd), then go through the mirror browser, etc etc. Are distributions of binary distributions outstripping source downloads the degree that this page layout would seem to imply? Ray. ------------------------------------------------------------------ Raymond O'Donnell, Director of Music, Galway Cathedral, Ireland rod@iol.ie Galway Cathedral Recitals: http://www.galwaycathedral.org/recitals ------------------------------------------------------------------
On 17/12/2008 18:52, Raymond O'Donnell wrote: > Without getting into the debate about which distributions should or > shouldn't be on the download page, I was surprised recently to encounter > difficulty finding the source code. I should have added that this isn't meant as a criticism....just surprised. Ray. ------------------------------------------------------------------ Raymond O'Donnell, Director of Music, Galway Cathedral, Ireland rod@iol.ie Galway Cathedral Recitals: http://www.galwaycathedral.org/recitals ------------------------------------------------------------------
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 6:52 PM, Raymond O'Donnell <rod@iol.ie> wrote: > Without getting into the debate about which distributions should or > shouldn't be on the download page, I was surprised recently to encounter > difficulty finding the source code. It's supposed to be below the binaries, but it does seem to have slipped lower than it should (ie. it should be above third party and CDs/appliances). I'll fix that. The basic philosophy btw, is to put the easiest to use options first, to minimise the amount of pain a new user has to go through to get up and running. The savvy users have no problem jumping to the distro-specific options when they want them, whilst the less experienced users sometimes have no idea what they need at all, and will just go elsewhere if they can't figure it out in a few minutes. We know for a fact that this used to happen quite regularly, though for various reasons I cannot say how we know that. -- Dave Page EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
On Wednesday 17 December 2008 20:52:28 Raymond O'Donnell wrote: > Without getting into the debate about which distributions should or > shouldn't be on the download page, I was surprised recently to encounter > difficulty finding the source code. > Are distributions of binary distributions outstripping source downloads > the degree that this page layout would seem to imply? Well, people are usually better off getting the binaries if possible. It might be good to have a small table of contents listing at the top of the downloads page, because otherwise finding the source is really hard. The source is our primary product, after all. In any case, putting development snapshots before source has got to be completely wrong.
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 7:55 PM, Peter Eisentraut <peter_e@gmx.net> wrote: > In any case, putting development snapshots before source has got to be > completely wrong. I've just committed a fix to put the source back where it should be (i.e. right below the production binaries). -- Dave Page EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
On 17/12/2008 20:00, Dave Page wrote: > I've just committed a fix to put the source back where it should be > (i.e. right below the production binaries). Thanks Dave - it's popped back up now. Ray. ------------------------------------------------------------------ Raymond O'Donnell, Director of Music, Galway Cathedral, Ireland rod@iol.ie Galway Cathedral Recitals: http://www.galwaycathedral.org/recitals ------------------------------------------------------------------