Обсуждение: [noreply@postgresql.org: coder]
Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word? What is causing this? --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Forwarded message from PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> ----- Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2018 15:29:32 +0000 From: PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> To: pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org Cc: melatti.michael@gmail.com Subject: coder The following documentation comment has been logged on the website: Page: https://www.postgresql.org/docs/10/static/cube.html Description: student ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com + As you are, so once was I. As I am, so you will be. + + Ancient Roman grave inscription +
People creating an account, then logging in, and then submitting just one word. That's at least the technical reason for it.
Here's a thought: trap *all* documentation comments in moderation, and have the moderators sort things out before they are posted.
Today we can't efficiently do it based on sender, due to having the noreply sender. But we could trap *all* of them based on regexp.
//Magnus
On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 4:46 PM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:
Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word?
What is causing this?
------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------
----- Forwarded message from PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> -----
Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2018 15:29:32 +0000
From: PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org>
To: pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org
Cc: melatti.michael@gmail.com
Subject: coder
The following documentation comment has been logged on the website:
Page: https://www.postgresql.org/docs/10/static/cube.html
Description:
student
----- End forwarded message -----
--
Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us
EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com
+ As you are, so once was I. As I am, so you will be. +
+ Ancient Roman grave inscription +
It's very likely a spam probe. > On Apr 3, 2018, at 07:50, Magnus Hagander <magnus@hagander.net> wrote: > > People creating an account, then logging in, and then submitting just one word. That's at least the technical reason forit. > > Here's a thought: trap *all* documentation comments in moderation, and have the moderators sort things out before theyare posted. > > Today we can't efficiently do it based on sender, due to having the noreply sender. But we could trap *all* of them basedon regexp. > > //Magnus > > > On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 4:46 PM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote: > > Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word? > What is causing this? > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ----- Forwarded message from PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> ----- > > Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2018 15:29:32 +0000 > From: PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> > To: pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org > Cc: melatti.michael@gmail.com > Subject: coder > > The following documentation comment has been logged on the website: > > Page: https://www.postgresql.org/docs/10/static/cube.html > Description: > > student > > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > -- > Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us > EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com > > + As you are, so once was I. As I am, so you will be. + > + Ancient Roman grave inscription + > > -- -- Christophe Pettus xof@thebuild.com
On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 07:53:36AM -0700, Christophe Pettus wrote: > It's very likely a spam probe. Oh, OK. Makes sense. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > On Apr 3, 2018, at 07:50, Magnus Hagander <magnus@hagander.net> wrote: > > > > People creating an account, then logging in, and then submitting just one word. That's at least the technical reasonfor it. > > > > Here's a thought: trap *all* documentation comments in moderation, and have the moderators sort things out before theyare posted. > > > > Today we can't efficiently do it based on sender, due to having the noreply sender. But we could trap *all* of them basedon regexp. > > > > //Magnus > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 4:46 PM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote: > > > > Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word? > > What is causing this? > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ----- Forwarded message from PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> ----- > > > > Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2018 15:29:32 +0000 > > From: PG Doc comments form <noreply@postgresql.org> > > To: pgsql-docs@lists.postgresql.org > > Cc: melatti.michael@gmail.com > > Subject: coder > > > > The following documentation comment has been logged on the website: > > > > Page: https://www.postgresql.org/docs/10/static/cube.html > > Description: > > > > student > > > > > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > > > -- > > Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us > > EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com > > > > + As you are, so once was I. As I am, so you will be. + > > + Ancient Roman grave inscription + > > > > > > -- > -- Christophe Pettus > xof@thebuild.com > -- Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com + As you are, so once was I. As I am, so you will be. + + Ancient Roman grave inscription +
Bruce Momjian wrote: > > Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word? > What is causing this? The form itself is causing it. Have a look at it: https://www.postgresql.org/account/comments/new/10/backup.html/ it asks for my name, then my "short description", then "details". OK, so my short description is that I'm a coder, and perhaps I don't want to enter a long description, so I click "save" --> surely the next page will ask for my comment, right? (The form does indicate "please fill out this field" if I leave short desc empty, so by that point I'm probably annoyed that it's asking for so many personal details. It's good that it doesn't *require* my whole bio!). I think there should a clear separation between the two fields on top and the two ones at the bottom. Maybe just a line of text that says "Please enter your documentation comment below". -- Álvaro Herrera https://www.2ndQuadrant.com/ PostgreSQL Development, 24x7 Support, Remote DBA, Training & Services
On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 5:00 PM, Alvaro Herrera <alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org> wrote:
Bruce Momjian wrote:
>
> Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word?
> What is causing this?
The form itself is causing it. Have a look at it:
https://www.postgresql.org/account/comments/new/10/ backup.html/
it asks for my name, then my "short description", then "details". OK,
so my short description is that I'm a coder, and perhaps I don't want to
enter a long description, so I click "save" --> surely the next page
will ask for my comment, right? (The form does indicate "please fill
out this field" if I leave short desc empty, so by that point I'm
probably annoyed that it's asking for so many personal details. It's
good that it doesn't *require* my whole bio!).
I think there should a clear separation between the two fields on top
and the two ones at the bottom. Maybe just a line of text that says
"Please enter your documentation comment below".
Not entirely correct. In this example, "student" was written under "details". And "coder" under short description.
But yes, those fields are clearly badly named. How about we just name them "subject" and "comment"?
Greetings, * Magnus Hagander (magnus@hagander.net) wrote: > On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 5:00 PM, Alvaro Herrera <alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org> > wrote: > > > Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word? > > > What is causing this? > > > > The form itself is causing it. Have a look at it: > > https://www.postgresql.org/account/comments/new/10/backup.html/ > > > > it asks for my name, then my "short description", then "details". OK, > > so my short description is that I'm a coder, and perhaps I don't want to > > enter a long description, so I click "save" --> surely the next page > > will ask for my comment, right? (The form does indicate "please fill > > out this field" if I leave short desc empty, so by that point I'm > > probably annoyed that it's asking for so many personal details. It's > > good that it doesn't *require* my whole bio!). > > > > I think there should a clear separation between the two fields on top > > and the two ones at the bottom. Maybe just a line of text that says > > "Please enter your documentation comment below". Yeah, I tend to agree that this is something to do with the form and not a spam probe or similar- that recent one of a one-word doc email and then a fully-formed email with good content is a great example of how the form is confusing in that regard. > Not entirely correct. In this example, "student" was written under > "details". And "coder" under short description. > > But yes, those fields are clearly badly named. How about we just name them > "subject" and "comment"? Or Subject and Body? Or Subject and Email? The other thing I was thinking about would be to change the 'Save' button to read something like "Send Email" or "Submit Report" or something that makes it clearer that clicking the button is going to actually send an email without any further ado. Thanks! Stephen
Вложения
> On Apr 3, 2018, at 11:48 AM, Stephen Frost <sfrost@snowman.net> wrote: > > Greetings, > > * Magnus Hagander (magnus@hagander.net) wrote: >> On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 5:00 PM, Alvaro Herrera <alvherre@alvh.no-ip.org> >> wrote: >> >>> Bruce Momjian wrote: >>>> Does anyone know why our documentation comments are often just one word? >>>> What is causing this? >>> >>> The form itself is causing it. Have a look at it: >>> https://www.postgresql.org/account/comments/new/10/backup.html/ >>> >>> it asks for my name, then my "short description", then "details". OK, >>> so my short description is that I'm a coder, and perhaps I don't want to >>> enter a long description, so I click "save" --> surely the next page >>> will ask for my comment, right? (The form does indicate "please fill >>> out this field" if I leave short desc empty, so by that point I'm >>> probably annoyed that it's asking for so many personal details. It's >>> good that it doesn't *require* my whole bio!). >>> >>> I think there should a clear separation between the two fields on top >>> and the two ones at the bottom. Maybe just a line of text that says >>> "Please enter your documentation comment below". > > Yeah, I tend to agree that this is something to do with the form and not > a spam probe or similar- that recent one of a one-word doc email and > then a fully-formed email with good content is a great example of how > the form is confusing in that regard. We may have updated this in the site refresh. Will take a look and get back on that. >> Not entirely correct. In this example, "student" was written under >> "details". And "coder" under short description. >> >> But yes, those fields are clearly badly named. How about we just name them >> "subject" and "comment"? > > Or Subject and Body? Or Subject and Email? Or add a few words like “Please explain why you are commenting on this page” > The other thing I was thinking about would be to change the 'Save' > button to read something like "Send Email" or "Submit Report" or > something that makes it clearer that clicking the button is going to > actually send an email without any further ado. I think “Send Email” is even more enticing for spamming. Perhaps text explaining what happens once the comment is submitted would work. I would +1 modding the emails coming in through this channel. The volume is low enough that it should not burden the mods. And to help with any increase in volume, I’m happy to help with the screening. Thanks, Jonathan
I would +1 modding the emails coming in
through this channel. The volume is low
enough that it should not burden the mods.
And to help with any increase in volume,
I’m happy to help with the screening.
I won't object to additional moderation but it doesn't seem warranted at this time. I too think that at least some of the issues are form presentation related and are on their way to being improved so things will probably improve, and they aren't particular bad right now.
David J.
David G. Johnston wrote: > On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 1:16 PM, Jonathan S. Katz <jkatz@postgresql.org> > wrote: > > > I would +1 modding the emails coming in > > through this channel. The volume is low > > enough that it should not burden the mods. > > And to help with any increase in volume, > > I’m happy to help with the screening. > > I won't object to additional moderation but it doesn't seem warranted at > this time. I too think that at least some of the issues are form > presentation related and are on their way to being improved so things will > probably improve, and they aren't particular bad right now. +1. I do object, kinda -- surely we have better uses of Jonathan's time :-) We used to moderate doc comments, and it was a terrible system ... -- Álvaro Herrera https://www.2ndQuadrant.com/ PostgreSQL Development, 24x7 Support, Remote DBA, Training & Services
On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 06:24:25PM -0300, Álvaro Herrera wrote: > David G. Johnston wrote: > > On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 1:16 PM, Jonathan S. Katz <jkatz@postgresql.org> > > wrote: > > > > > I would +1 modding the emails coming in > > > through this channel. The volume is low > > > enough that it should not burden the mods. > > > And to help with any increase in volume, > > > I’m happy to help with the screening. > > > > I won't object to additional moderation but it doesn't seem warranted at > > this time. I too think that at least some of the issues are form > > presentation related and are on their way to being improved so things will > > probably improve, and they aren't particular bad right now. > > +1. I do object, kinda -- surely we have better uses of Jonathan's time > :-) We used to moderate doc comments, and it was a terrible system ... Agreed. Let's first clarify the web page and see how much it fixes. -- Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com + As you are, so once was I. As I am, so you will be. + + Ancient Roman grave inscription +
On Apr 4, 2018, at 7:05 PM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 06:24:25PM -0300, Álvaro Herrera wrote:David G. Johnston wrote:On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 1:16 PM, Jonathan S. Katz <jkatz@postgresql.org>
wrote:I would +1 modding the emails coming in
through this channel. The volume is low
enough that it should not burden the mods.
And to help with any increase in volume,
I’m happy to help with the screening.
I won't object to additional moderation but it doesn't seem warranted at
this time. I too think that at least some of the issues are form
presentation related and are on their way to being improved so things will
probably improve, and they aren't particular bad right now.
+1. I do object, kinda -- surely we have better uses of Jonathan's time
:-) We used to moderate doc comments, and it was a terrible system …
Thanks for the concern. If push comes to show, I find email moderation is an
O(1) operation, but yes could become O(n).
Agreed. Let's first clarify the web page and see how much it fixes.
Please see attached screenshot in terms of the direction we're thinking.
Apologies for not having it as a diff, but the section of the code it lives in
would not produce an easy-to-read diff.
Jonathan
Вложения
On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 1:05 AM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 06:24:25PM -0300, Álvaro Herrera wrote:
> David G. Johnston wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 3, 2018 at 1:16 PM, Jonathan S. Katz <jkatz@postgresql.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I would +1 modding the emails coming in
> > > through this channel. The volume is low
> > > enough that it should not burden the mods.
> > > And to help with any increase in volume,
> > > I’m happy to help with the screening.
> >
> > I won't object to additional moderation but it doesn't seem warranted at
> > this time. I too think that at least some of the issues are form
> > presentation related and are on their way to being improved so things will
> > probably improve, and they aren't particular bad right now.
>
> +1. I do object, kinda -- surely we have better uses of Jonathan's time
> :-) We used to moderate doc comments, and it was a terrible system ...
Agreed. Let's first clarify the web page and see how much it fixes.
I have pushed an update with this to the main website. Jonathan will be merging it up with the work he's been doing on the bigger updates.