Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates

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Joe Conway
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Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates
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88999a53-d15c-4e46-88fd-c7565a86c4b3@joeconway.com
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[18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Laurenz Albe <laurenz.albe@cybertec.at>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Peter Eisentraut <peter@eisentraut.org>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Laurenz Albe <laurenz.albe@cybertec.at>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Isaac Morland <isaac.morland@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Laurenz Albe <laurenz.albe@cybertec.at>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeremy Schneider <schneider@ardentperf.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Joe Conway <mail@joeconway.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates "Daniel Verite" <daniel@manitou-mail.org>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Peter Eisentraut <peter@eisentraut.org>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Peter Eisentraut <peter@eisentraut.org>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeremy Schneider <schneider@ardentperf.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeremy Schneider <schneider@ardentperf.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Peter Eisentraut <peter@eisentraut.org>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Robert Haas <robertmhaas@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Noah Misch <noah@leadboat.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Noah Misch <noah@leadboat.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Joe Conway <mail@joeconway.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates "David G. Johnston" <david.g.johnston@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Joe Conway <mail@joeconway.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Joe Conway <mail@joeconway.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Tom Lane <tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates "David G. Johnston" <david.g.johnston@gmail.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeff Davis <pgsql@j-davis.com>
Re: [18] Policy on IMMUTABLE functions and Unicode updates Jeremy Schneider <schneider@ardentperf.com>
On 7/23/24 15:26, Tom Lane wrote:
> Robert Haas  writes:
>> Also, Noah has pointed out that C.UTF-8 introduces some
>> forward-compatibility hazards of its own, at least with respect to
>> ctype semantics. I don't have a clear view of what ought to be done
>> about that, but if we just replace a dependency on an unstable set of
>> libc definitions with a dependency on an equally unstable set of
>> PostgreSQL definitions, we're not really winning.
> 
> No, I think we *are* winning, because the updates are not "equally
> unstable": with pg_c_utf8, we control when changes happen.  We can
> align them with major releases and release-note the differences.
> With libc-based collations, we have zero control and not much
> notification.

+1

>> Do we need to version the new ctype provider?
> 
> It would be a version for the underlying Unicode definitions,
> not the provider as such, but perhaps yes.  I don't know to what
> extent doing so would satisfy Noah's concern; but if it would do
> so I'd be happy with that answer.

I came to the same conclusion. I think someone mentioned somewhere on 
this thread that other databases support multiple Unicode versions. I 
think we need to figure out how to do that too.

-- 
Joe Conway
PostgreSQL Contributors Team
RDS Open Source Databases
Amazon Web Services: https://aws.amazon.com



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