Обсуждение: postgresql -- what's in a name?
i'm guessing there was a GRE project first, and that the
successor was POSTgre (involving sql, of course). if so, what's
the GRE stand for?
otherwise in general, what's the origin of the name
"postgresql"? (and why does it seem like it should be
pronounced "pissquel"?)
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On Sun, 10 Feb 2002, will trillich wrote: > i'm guessing there was a GRE project first, and that the > successor was POSTgre (involving sql, of course). if so, what's > the GRE stand for? What the hell is postgre? If you're looking for the history of PostgreSQL you can find a link to the "history" on the website's announcements page (and mirrors). > otherwise in general, what's the origin of the name > "postgresql"? (and why does it seem like it should be > pronounced "pissquel"?) There's a wav and an mp3 file also on the announcements page (and mirrors) of the website. The announcements page is the main or first page. Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com http://www.pop4.net 56K Nationwide Dialup from $16.00/mo at Pop4 Networking Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ==========================================================================
http://developer.postgresql.org/pdf/history.pdf May help enlighten you... -Doug -- Let us cross over the river, and rest under the shade of the trees. --T. J. Jackson, 1863
on Sun, Feb 10, 2002, a busy guru snipped:
> What the hell is postgre? If you're looking for the history of
> PostgreSQL you can find a link to the "history" on the website's
> announcements page (and mirrors).
i'm not.
<note target="guru">
if you don't think it's worth your time to answer, please go
with your instincts.
</note>
i'm looking for the history of the NAME, not the history of the
project.
the history page says nothing about the etymology -- except it
mentions intellectual predecessors, by name, in passing. so i
INFER (it's just a guess, of course, since it's not covered on
the history page) that if ingres came first and postgresql was
based on it, the logical successor might be aptly named
post-ingres, or postgres for short.
or perhaps the name postgres or postgre or postgresql means
something in its own right? aztec for 'think for yourself' maybe?
or mandarin for 'open source rocks'? sanskrit for 'awesome
cruncher' perhaps?
or, if postgres was named post-ingres, then what or who was the
mysterious ingres? was that somebody's name before it applied to
the relational technologies/ingres corporation? and why'd we
drop the "in" prefix in that case?
i know WHERE THE #NAMES# CAME FROM for apple, linux, even q-dos
and cp/m. i'd like to know about the evolution of the name
"postgres".
--
and as for the pronunciation, let's say we'd like to have a
text-indexable and -searchable instance (commonly difficult to
do with an .mpg or .aiff or even -- heavens -- .wav file):
"we pronounce postgresql as 'plith'. there you go."
perhaps
<suggestion type="comedy">
"among the accepted pronunciations of 'postgresql' are:
post-GRESS-kwel
PISS-kule
PIG-skool
OR-ah-kel cun-TEN-der
MAIR-zee-doats
though not necessarily in that order. and with that,
we consider the matter closed. have a nice day."
</suggestion>
how about it? hmm? (again, if you don't think it's worth your
time to answer, go with your first impulse.)
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On Sun, Feb 10, 2002 at 08:03:27PM -0500, Doug McNaught wrote: > http://developer.postgresql.org/pdf/history.pdf > > May help enlighten you... i bet that was an interesting presentation! still, i'm after the etymology -- whence "postgres"? -- DEBIAN NEWBIE TIP #45 from Will Trillich <will@serensoft.com> : Troubled by DOS-FORMAT TEXT FILES? There are many ways to get rid of the extra ^M characters. In VIM, try :set ff=unix before saving the file (":opt" for more info); or, use perl: perl -pi.dos -e 's/\cM//g' filename*pattern.txt ("perldoc perlrun" for more info.) Also see http://newbieDoc.sourceForge.net/ ...
On Sun, 10 Feb 2002, will trillich wrote: > on Sun, Feb 10, 2002, a busy guru snipped: > > What the hell is postgre? If you're looking for the history of > > PostgreSQL you can find a link to the "history" on the website's > > announcements page (and mirrors). > > i'm not. Yes you are. (See your questions later in this email) > <note target="guru"> > if you don't think it's worth your time to answer, please go > with your instincts. > </note> > > i'm looking for the history of the NAME, not the history of the > project. After having read http://www.ca.postgresql.org/docs/devhistory.html (and some prior knowledge from having read pages on postgresql.org), here's the answer: It started out as "Ingres" - a project at UCB. Then it was taken by Michael Stonebraker, who led a team that worked on "Postgres" ("post-" as in "after-"), and developed into that. In 1995, it became Postgres95 - and the final name change came with the addition of SQL capabillities, at which point it became "PostgreSQL", the name it still has. > or, if postgres was named post-ingres, then what or who was the > mysterious ingres? was that somebody's name before it applied to > the relational technologies/ingres corporation? and why'd we > drop the "in" prefix in that case? If you'd read the above url, you'd have the answer to several of these questions.. As several people already suggested you do. Oh, wait - you don't want to know the history. Right. > how about it? hmm? (again, if you don't think it's worth your > time to answer, go with your first impulse.) Your apparent sarcasm is quite lacking in the "witty" category, and overly heavy on the "lame" category. -- Dominic J. Eidson "Baruk Khazad! Khazad ai-menu!" - Gimli ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.the-infinite.org/ http://www.the-infinite.org/~dominic/
"Dominic J. Eidson" <sauron@the-infinite.org> writes:
> It started out as "Ingres" - a project at UCB. Then it was taken by
> Michael Stonebraker, who led a team that worked on "Postgres"
> ("post-" as in "after-"), and developed into that.
"Taken" isn't the right word here, since Prof. Stonebraker was the lead
on both projects. Also, Postgres was not a revision of Ingres but a
complete new project with new goals and all-new code. See
http://s2k-ftp.CS.Berkeley.EDU:8000/postgres/postgres-v4r2/postgres.faq
(which can be reached from the POSTGRES link in our "What is
PostgreSQL?" documentation entry)
Karel posted a good summary awhile back:
http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-hackers/2001-11/msg01255.php
> In 1995, it became
> Postgres95 - and the final name change came with the addition of SQL
> capabillities, at which point it became "PostgreSQL", the name it still
> has.
Postgres95 was SQL, if I'm not mistaken.
regards, tom lane
On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Tom Lane wrote: > Postgres95 was SQL, if I'm not mistaken. Correct ... it was Jolly/Andrew's graduate project to take it from PostQuel->SQL, and they named it Postgres95 as a joke revolving around Windows95 at the time ..
On Monday 11 February 2002 09:37 am, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Tom Lane wrote: > > Postgres95 was SQL, if I'm not mistaken. > Correct ... it was Jolly/Andrew's graduate project to take it from > PostQuel->SQL, and they named it Postgres95 as a joke revolving around > Windows95 at the time .. Ok. To those who flamed Will for not reading the project history, this is the kind of etymology he's talking about. He's not wanting 'Postgres became postgres95 which became postgresql' -- he's wanting the kind of information Marc just gave. What's interesting is not that it was called postgres; what's interesting is WHY it's called postgres. So, to all those who felt a need to be too snippy at Will's question, please, just count ten and either answer nicely or don't answer. Please? The history of the name != the history of the project. -- Lamar Owen WGCR Internet Radio 1 Peter 4:11
Yes, but Will can also simply ask and move on...for all we care, he can rename
the entire program set to foo, goo, and whatever. Wasting this channel's
bandwidth might lure other participants away, thinking this is a chat room.
the entire program set to foo, goo, and whatever. Wasting this channel's
bandwidth might lure other participants away, thinking this is a chat room.
Lamar Owen wrote:
On Monday 11 February 2002 09:37 am, Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> On Mon, 11 Feb 2002, Tom Lane wrote:
> > Postgres95 was SQL, if I'm not mistaken.> Correct ... it was Jolly/Andrew's graduate project to take it from
> PostQuel->SQL, and they named it Postgres95 as a joke revolving around
> Windows95 at the time ..Ok.
To those who flamed Will for not reading the project history, this is the
kind of etymology he's talking about. He's not wanting 'Postgres became
postgres95 which became postgresql' -- he's wanting the kind of information
Marc just gave.What's interesting is not that it was called postgres; what's interesting is
WHY it's called postgres. So, to all those who felt a need to be too snippy
at Will's question, please, just count ten and either answer nicely or don't
answer. Please?The history of the name != the history of the project.
--
Lamar Owen
WGCR Internet Radio
1 Peter 4:11---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
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-- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Medi Montaseri medi@CyberShell.com Unix Distributed Systems Engineer HTTP://www.CyberShell.com CyberShell Engineering -------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Mon, Feb 11, 2002 at 01:10:23AM -0500, Tom Lane wrote: > Karel posted a good summary awhile back: > http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-hackers/2001-11/msg01255.php aha! <quoting> Ingres - 1982 -- 1985 - Michael Stonebraker and Eugene Wong at UC-Berkeley - Ingres = Interactive Graphics and Retrieval System - original developed on PDP-11/45 - original query language was QUEL Postgres - 1985(?) - 1994 - based on Ingres - start with idea make Ingres more OO - the father was again Stonebraker </quoting> i knew there was a good reason to like postgresql -- its ancestry includes the pdp-11! :) and the name postgres is from post-ingres, which stood for "INteractive Graphics and REtrieval System". the acronym is a bit off ("ingres" instead of "igrs" or "igars") but there it is. and thus we have the etymology of the name "postgres" and by extension, "postgresql". :) thanks! -- DEBIAN NEWBIE TIP #86 from USM Bish <bish@nde.vsnl.net.in> : Tired of looking at the black and white? Make it a WHITE ON BLUE CONSOLE by adding the following to your .bashrc setterm -background blue -store setterm -foreground white -store See "man setterm". Also see http://newbieDoc.sourceForge.net/ ...
the biggest chunk of bandwidth consumed by this exchange was your reply, by the way: 101 lines -- far and away the biggest chunk of traffic in the entire exchange. physician, heal thyself. On Mon, Feb 11, 2002 at 08:49:10PM -0800, Medi Montaseri wrote: > Yes, but Will can also simply ask and move on...for all we care, he can rename > the entire program set to foo, goo, and whatever. Wasting this channel's > bandwidth might lure other participants away, thinking this is a chat room. i did ask. and got spanked, so i tried rewording my question, since my first iteration was misinterpreted by many. and i got spanked again. is THAT the type of lure you expect to make your e-list grow? how about discussing interesting aspects of the project, in addition to 'please solve my sql problem for me' questions? just an idea. "chat room" you say? get real. next time when someone asks something and it gets under your skin -- make sure you understand what they're asking. discussing the name of this project may be a bit off topic (altho the name of the list is pgsql-general, not pgsql-execution-questions) but it sure isn't teen gossip. either skip the post altogether or take a breath and see if you can figure out what the asker is really after. don't just jump down their throat with a knee-jerk 'read the goddam faq' reply. (if they're truly being lazy, BE SURE ABOUT IT and *then* jump down their throats.) luckily, tom and others supplied useful information and i managed to find the answer to my question, despite your best efforts to send me packing. nonnie nonnie boo boo. :p -- Legalize Liberty. will@serensoft.com http://sourceforge.net/projects/newbiedoc -- we need your brain! http://www.dontUthink.com/ -- your brain needs us!
--On mardi 12 février 2002 01:18 -0600 will trillich <will@serensoft.com>
wrote:
> and the name postgres is from post-ingres, which stood for
> "INteractive Graphics and REtrieval System". the acronym is a
> bit off ("ingres" instead of "igrs" or "igars") but there it is.
I'll wager the acronym's author was fond of the famous painter
Jean-Auguste-Dominique Ingres
http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/ingres/
--
Eric Cholet
Hi, Below is a short history of PostgreSQL. I am not the author, and do not remember where I got these... Regards, Devrim ------------------------------------ A short history of PostgreSQL PostgreSQL can trace its family tree back to 1977 at the University of California at Berkeley (UCB). A relational database called Ingres was developed at UCB between 1977 and 1985. Ingres was a popular UCB export, making an appearance on very many UNIX computers in academic and research communities. To serve the commercial marketplace the code for Ingres was taken by Relational Technologies/Ingres Corporation and became one of the first commercially available relational database management systems. Today Ingres has become CA-INGRES II a product from Computer Associates. It is hard to say whether any of the original UCB code still survives in this modern day product. Meanwhile, back at Berkeley work on a relational database server called Postgres continued from 1986 to 1994. Again, this code was taken up by a commercial company and offered for sale as a product. This time it was Illustra, since swallowed up by Informix. Around 1994 SQL features were added to Postgres and its name was changed to Postgres95. By 1996 Postgres was becoming very popular and the decision was taken to open up its development to a mailing list, starting what has become a very successful collaboration of volunteers in driving Postgres forward. At this time Postgres underwent its final name change, ditching the now dated 95 tag for a more appropriate SQL to reflect the support Postgres now had for the query language standard. So was PostgreSQL born. Today a team of Internet developers develops PostgreSQL in much the same manner as other Open Source software such as Perl, Apache and PHP. Users have access to the source code and contribute fixes, enhancements and suggestions for new features. The official PostgreSQL releases are made via the PostgreSQL.org website. Commercial support is available from Great Bridge, who also employ some of the PostgreSQL developers too. See the Resources section at the end of the chapter for more details. -- Devrim GUNDUZ devrim@oper.metu.edu.tr devrim.gunduz@linux.org.tr devrimg@tr.net Web : http://devrim.oper.metu.edu.tr ------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Cholet wrote:
> --On mardi 12 f?vrier 2002 01:18 -0600 will trillich <will@serensoft.com>
> wrote:
>
> > and the name postgres is from post-ingres, which stood for
> > "INteractive Graphics and REtrieval System". the acronym is a
> > bit off ("ingres" instead of "igrs" or "igars") but there it is.
>
> I'll wager the acronym's author was fond of the famous painter
> Jean-Auguste-Dominique Ingres
>
> http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/ingres/
Maybe. I saw a painting by Ingres somewhere, I think it was in Spain,
and it sort of looked strange --- the name "Ingres" under a painting.
--
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pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000
+ If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue
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> Commercial support is available from Great Bridge, who also employ some of > the PostgreSQL developers too. See the Resources section at the end of the > chapter for more details. This must be from some Great Bridge sponsored author because there is no mention of other PostgreSQL support companies. -- Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
Hi, On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > Commercial support is available from Great Bridge, who also employ some of > > the PostgreSQL developers too. See the Resources section at the end of the > > chapter for more details. > > This must be from some Great Bridge sponsored author because there is no > mention of other PostgreSQL support companies. As far as I remember, this was from a book. In addition, this has been written before greatbtridge.org was off, I think... Regards and best wishes. -- Devrim GUNDUZ devrim@oper.metu.edu.tr devrim.gunduz@linux.org.tr devrimg@tr.net Web : http://devrim.oper.metu.edu.tr ------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi, > Postgres95 was SQL, if I'm not mistaken. You are not :) It's when we started to use Postgres* as a backend for our website and accounting system. A looooooong time ago! Sander.