Re: [Bulk] General advice on database/web applications

I would normally put the database inside my LAN and only accesible
from boxes in the DMZ through certain ports (remoting). I usually not
let the web application access the database directly. I use business
objects through remoting and only have those business objects
available to the web application and not the data directly.

regards,

Jonel

On 3/27/06, Mark Feller <mfeller@mgako.com> wrote:
> The webserver runs linux and I also have iptables on that server filtering
> out all but HTTP and SSH traffic.
>
> I have not yet implemented the database, and I am VERY reluctant to put the
> full db outside our "main" firewall because of the need to protect sensitive
> info.  So my question, is how do the applications on the webserver interface
> with the database?  My one thought for a solution is to have a more limited
> database hosted on the same machine as the webserver that would have
> customer account number, price lists, and product lists--enough for an order
> to be taken.  Credit info, etc. is stored someplace more secure.  After an
> order is taken, the webserver/database/something then forwards an "order
> placed" type of message to the main database.  Maybe a synch is done between
> webserver database and main database every five minutes, where the main
> database pulls any new orders, and pushes any updated part lists, pricing
> etc. to the webserver db?
>
> My question, is would such a scheme be practical, or is there a "best
> practices" type of approach that I should consider instead, such as the
> suggestion in your next-to-last paragraph?
>
> Thanks.
>
> --Mark
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ted Byers [mailto:r.ted.byers@rogers.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 2:54 PM
> To: Mark Feller; pgsql-general@postgresql.org
> Subject: Re: [Bulk] [GENERAL] General advice on database/web
> applications
>
>
> >
> > I am developing a small web application.  Currently, our web server is
> > sitting outside our firewall (running its own firewall), and the
> > application
> > being developed would let users do things like place orders.
> >
> > My question is...what and where is the database for this?
> >
> What do you mean when you say your web server is running its own firewall?
> I could well be wrong, but I am not aware of a web server that can run a
> firewall; web servers and firewalls are, as I understand them, quite
> different kinds of software, though I am aware of some hardware that have
> built in firewalls.
>
> Your question, though, doesn't make sense.  If, as you say explicitly in
> your first sentence, that you're developing a small web application, then
> either you don't have a database and need to create it, or you have already
> created your database and know both where and what it is.  If you haven't
> created it already, then you can create it and you have absolute control
> over where to put it and what RDBMS to use.  The only circumstance in which
> I could imagine you having a database back end for your application but not
> knowing about it is if you bought hosting services from a company that
> provides such services.  But if that's the case, then you ought to be asking
> that company about it.  But if that's the case, they probably already have a
> ready made virtual store application for you to use, which makes developing
> your own unnecessary unless you're planning to do your own hosting, and that
> takes us back to you having complete control over what you use and where you
> put it.
>
> If I were to create such a web application as you describe, I'd create a
> database using PostgreSQL or something similar and have it live inside the
> firewall, configured to respond only to applications running behind the
> firewall.  Under no circumstances would I want it to accept connections
> across the firewall.  Similarly, I'd have my application server and my httpd
> server behind the firewall and configured to accept connections across the
> firewall but only from proxy servers set up in a DMZ.
>
> Since you are dealing with sensitive information such as financial data, you
> are going to have to design security into your application from start to
> finish, and then harden your entire network inside and out, including
> especially your firewall and each machine individually.  You have some legal
> responsibilities to protect your clients' data.  I'm told, by folk who ought
> to know, that you could face major problems if you fail to exercise due
> diligence in protecting your clients' data.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ted
>
>
>
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--
Jonel Rienton
mailto:jonel@rientongroup.com
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