Обсуждение: Re: [GENERAL] PostgreSQL Licence: GNU/GPL
> It's really noone's business why any of us dislike it. My reasons may > or may not be different than yours which may/may not be different from > Marc's, and so on. Why try to summarize everyone's feelings when it's > unnecessary. My statement never said that we just don't like it, it > was clear that many of the developers were uncomfortable with its > restrictions. Break it down. What are "many of the developers" > uncomfortable with? The GPL's restrictions. What's not clear about > that? It didn't say "many of the developers just don't like it", that > would border on confrontational. You're not going to change the minds > of those that favor GPL just as you're not going to change the minds > of those that prefer BSD. Isn't it the restrictions on proprietary use that we dislike? Seems we should say that in there. -- Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
I think, and Vince can correct me if I'm wrong, but Vince is pointing out the whole 'Many of the Developers' thing ... if we are (or at least appear to be) unanimous in this, then there is nothing to discuss ... if "Many of the developers' are uncomfortable, then obviously there are ones out there that aren't, and that is where the whole "confrontation" I think arises ... Why does this discussion get started over and over again? Because one person brings it up, and those in favor of GPL generally pop up thereafter, and it just goes around ... if we get rid of 'the Many' part, then you are saying "thi sis the way it is, this is the way it stays, no discussion" ... On Mon, 21 Jan 2002, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > It's really noone's business why any of us dislike it. My reasons may > > or may not be different than yours which may/may not be different from > > Marc's, and so on. Why try to summarize everyone's feelings when it's > > unnecessary. My statement never said that we just don't like it, it > > was clear that many of the developers were uncomfortable with its > > restrictions. Break it down. What are "many of the developers" > > uncomfortable with? The GPL's restrictions. What's not clear about > > that? It didn't say "many of the developers just don't like it", that > > would border on confrontational. You're not going to change the minds > > of those that favor GPL just as you're not going to change the minds > > of those that prefer BSD. > > Isn't it the restrictions on proprietary use that we dislike? Seems we > should say that in there. > > -- > Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us > pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 > + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue > + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026 >
Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > I think, and Vince can correct me if I'm wrong, but Vince is pointing out > the whole 'Many of the Developers' thing ... if we are (or at least appear > to be) unanimous in this, then there is nothing to discuss ... if "Many of > the developers' are uncomfortable, then obviously there are ones out there > that aren't, and that is where the whole "confrontation" I think arises > ... > > Why does this discussion get started over and over again? Because one > person brings it up, and those in favor of GPL generally pop up > thereafter, and it just goes around ... > > if we get rid of 'the Many' part, then you are saying "thi sis the way it > is, this is the way it stays, no discussion" ... But Vince's text is below. It starts with "Many". I merely grafted his text after my opening text: Many PostgreSQL developers past and present are uncomfortable with restrictions imposed by the GPL. The PostgreSQL project always has and will continue to remain under the BSD license alone. -- Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > It's really noone's business why any of us dislike it. My reasons may > > or may not be different than yours which may/may not be different from > > Marc's, and so on. Why try to summarize everyone's feelings when it's > > unnecessary. My statement never said that we just don't like it, it > > was clear that many of the developers were uncomfortable with its > > restrictions. Break it down. What are "many of the developers" > > uncomfortable with? The GPL's restrictions. What's not clear about > > that? It didn't say "many of the developers just don't like it", that > > would border on confrontational. You're not going to change the minds > > of those that favor GPL just as you're not going to change the minds > > of those that prefer BSD. > > Isn't it the restrictions on proprietary use that we dislike? Seems we > should say that in there. Is it necessary to say you don't like the GPL? Isn't it sufficient to just say it is counter to policy? I think the problem with writing this thing is the emotional attachment both camps have to their license. I think any attempt to say you dislike GPL for any reason invites debate. Forget it, just say for historical reasons and with respect for all the people that made PostgreSQL what it is today, the license will remain as it always has. > > -- > Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us > pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 > + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue > + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026
Sorry for adding to this already long (and previously discussed) thread but I don't see much need in justifying the BSD license, just say "Hey, it's what we've had, we like it and we don't want to change it Thanks very much for your opinion but it's been discussed and the decision to stay with the BSD license has been made" There we go! PostgreSQL developers (and users) don't need to answer to anyone in my opinion and I think the statement should reflect that in the nicest way possible.. Just a "thanks but no thanks" in the FAQ and add a note asking people to please not bring it up again :-) *deposits $0.02* -Mitch
On Mon, 21 Jan 2002, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > It's really noone's business why any of us dislike it. My reasons may > > or may not be different than yours which may/may not be different from > > Marc's, and so on. Why try to summarize everyone's feelings when it's > > unnecessary. My statement never said that we just don't like it, it > > was clear that many of the developers were uncomfortable with its > > restrictions. Break it down. What are "many of the developers" > > uncomfortable with? The GPL's restrictions. What's not clear about > > that? It didn't say "many of the developers just don't like it", that > > would border on confrontational. You're not going to change the minds > > of those that favor GPL just as you're not going to change the minds > > of those that prefer BSD. > > Isn't it the restrictions on proprietary use that we dislike? Seems we > should say that in there. Define we. Are you sure that that's *everyone's* dislike? Are you sure there aren't other reasons - Tom mentioned it's viral nature for one thing, which happens to be one of my dislikes but it's not the only one. Say that restriction was changed in the GPL, would you then want to change PostgreSQL to GPL? You might, but I doubt everyone would (and I'm sure Marc wouldn't). Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com http://www.pop4.net 56K Nationwide Dialup from $16.00/mo at Pop4 Networking Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ==========================================================================
On Mon, 21 Jan 2002, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > I think, and Vince can correct me if I'm wrong, but Vince is pointing out > the whole 'Many of the Developers' thing ... if we are (or at least appear > to be) unanimous in this, then there is nothing to discuss ... if "Many of > the developers' are uncomfortable, then obviously there are ones out there > that aren't, and that is where the whole "confrontation" I think arises > ... > > Why does this discussion get started over and over again? Because one > person brings it up, and those in favor of GPL generally pop up > thereafter, and it just goes around ... > > if we get rid of 'the Many' part, then you are saying "thi sis the way it > is, this is the way it stays, no discussion" ... I pondered "many". You can remove it if you wish, but you then paint all contributers with the same brush and I don't think that's true. Some being uncomfortable and some not is (imnsho) not confrontational at all, it merely states fact. If anything should be changed, it's the word "uncomfortable" is the whimpy one, but it's less confrontational than dislike, hate, etc. > > On Mon, 21 Jan 2002, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > > It's really noone's business why any of us dislike it. My reasons may > > > or may not be different than yours which may/may not be different from > > > Marc's, and so on. Why try to summarize everyone's feelings when it's > > > unnecessary. My statement never said that we just don't like it, it > > > was clear that many of the developers were uncomfortable with its > > > restrictions. Break it down. What are "many of the developers" > > > uncomfortable with? The GPL's restrictions. What's not clear about > > > that? It didn't say "many of the developers just don't like it", that > > > would border on confrontational. You're not going to change the minds > > > of those that favor GPL just as you're not going to change the minds > > > of those that prefer BSD. > > > > Isn't it the restrictions on proprietary use that we dislike? Seems we > > should say that in there. > > > > -- > > Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us > > pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 853-3000 > > + If your life is a hard drive, | 830 Blythe Avenue > > + Christ can be your backup. | Drexel Hill, Pennsylvania 19026 > > > > Vince. -- ========================================================================== Vince Vielhaber -- KA8CSH email: vev@michvhf.com http://www.pop4.net 56K Nationwide Dialup from $16.00/mo at Pop4 Networking Online Campground Directory http://www.camping-usa.com Online Giftshop Superstore http://www.cloudninegifts.com ==========================================================================